Caution: fake V9958s on AliExpress [message #10667] |
Sat, 06 April 2024 06:00  |
lynchaj
Messages: 1080 Registered: June 2016
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Senior Member |
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Hi
Please be careful when ordering V9958 (Yamaha VDP) from AliExpress. There are many vendors selling fakes. I have ordered several and ended up returning them for refunds because I cannot seem to get a legit item.
You can tell if the V9958s are fakes if they have a notch and are date codes 2703 2122 IACC. See this article below for more information:
https://hackaday.io/project/186450-msx1-homebrew-clone-for-b affa-2-project/log/216999-lots-and-lots-and-lots-of-fake-v99 58
I have asked vendors to send me photos of the actual V9958 and occasionally they do. I have detected fakes this way and canceled orders. However, I can confirm by actual experience these chips are fakes. I have tested on the duodyne Media IO board. It works fine with a real V9958 but does not with a fake V9958.
Good luck!
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Re: Caution: fake V9958s on AliExpress [message #10693 is a reply to message #10682] |
Wed, 10 April 2024 16:30   |
lynchaj
Messages: 1080 Registered: June 2016
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Senior Member |
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Hi
I did order a V9938 on AliExpress and got the real thing. I swapped out my real V9958 out of the Media IO board and am using the V9938 instead. Seems to work OK
This weekend I am going to test out my recently purchased HD63C09P CPUs but I think I know how that is going to go...
I can't stand scammers. The fake chip scammers are ruining AliExpress. I have ordered many, many parts there with generally good luck.
Until this last couple of months when the scammers are running wild. Jerks!
[Updated on: Wed, 10 April 2024 16:32] Report message to a moderator
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Re: Caution: fake V9958s on AliExpress [message #10697 is a reply to message #10694] |
Thu, 11 April 2024 09:37   |
lynchaj
Messages: 1080 Registered: June 2016
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Senior Member |
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Hi
One countermeasure against V9958 fakes I've been using recently on AliExpress is to request a photo of the actual device they are going to send. Their response is highly indicative of whether they are peddling fakes or not.
Legit vendors will happily post photos of valid V9958s. Vendors of fakes know that and with either post stock photos of V9958s or refuse to post. Even argue with you about it.
As soon as I order a V9958 on AliExpress, I contact the vendor and post this:
Quote:
Hi, please send me a photo of the actual V9958 part before you ship it. There are many fakes being sold and I would like to see what you are selling before I purchase. It will save you and me both time and money. I have a test board to verify it works.
Do not ship fake V9958 chip. Please send a photo of the actual chip. I can tell if they are fake immediately. If your chip is fake, please cancel order and do not ship. I have ordered many V9958 chips on AliExpress and returned all the fakes.
You can tell if the V9958s are fakes if they have a notch and are date codes 2703 2122 IACC. See link below for more information
https://hackaday.io/project/186450-msx1-homebrew-clone-for-b affa-2-project/log/216999-lots-and-lots-and-lots-of-fake-v99 58
I am not saying this technique is fool proof but the legit vendors post photos and if they have fakes will cancel the order. I don't think they want the negative feedback and would rather not deal with you if they know you're on to their game.
Of course, with a sufficiently scummy scammer, this could be easily duped. However, as soon as I receive the part, I am going to test it and if it is a fake I am going to send it back under "free returns" which costs the vendor time and money plus damages their reputation.
The key seems to be making selling fake V9958s as painful and expensive as possible for the fake vendors. Give them an easy way to escape. Let the marketplace drum them out.
Thanks, Andrew Lynch
[Updated on: Thu, 11 April 2024 09:40] Report message to a moderator
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Re: Caution: fake V9958s on AliExpress [message #10711 is a reply to message #10707] |
Sun, 14 April 2024 11:06   |
lynchaj
Messages: 1080 Registered: June 2016
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Senior Member |
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marcopolo wrote on Fri, 12 April 2024 15:32lynchaj wrote on Thu, 11 April 2024 10:35This looks like it could be a legit V9958. At least it is not an obvious fake.
This IC looks blacktopped
The indent should not been filled in with the "blacktopping" material.
See the photo of my HD63C09 above.

The reference seems to have been laser engraved, I don't have the impression that this technique was used in 1988, and it's far too clean.
But it could be an original chip. The Chinese often refurbish salvaged chips by blacktopping them so the buyer receives a chip that matches the photo.
Well, if it turns out to be fake even after doing due diligence, then I am going to send it back and post negative feedback on the vendor.
Fortunately, I already have a working V9958 and the Media IO board so it is a simple matter of testing the new chip to verify it works.
It clearly is not an obvious fake with the notch and the same date codes as all the other fakes. Worth taking a chance although I realize this is far from perfect.
If it is not real, I am sending back to AliExpress using their "free returns" policy. I am prepared to buy and return as many V9958s as necessary until I find a source of real ones. It may take several more tries to find them though.
I think this one as a decent chance of being real because others have bought legit V9958s from this particular dealer. Of course, that could be wishful thinking on my part.
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Re: Caution: fake V9958s on AliExpress [message #10715 is a reply to message #10713] |
Mon, 15 April 2024 04:50   |
marcopolo
Messages: 21 Registered: November 2020 Location: Nancy (FRANCE)
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Junior Member |
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I agree with Bill.
Andrew, you probably received a blacktopped HD63C09, it could be a 6809, a 68A09, a 68B09 or a 63B09
Please post a high-res photo.
The first test is to scrape the top of the circuit to see if any paint is peeling off (=blacktopped)
I'm not an HITACHI specialist, but you should be able to test this to see if you have a 63B09 or 63C09.
The MOTOROLA 6809 doesn't support additions between registers.
CC0102 LDD #$0102
103089 ADDR A,B
You should find $0003 in register B
Don't forget that for serious tests like speed, you need to switch the CPU from emulation mode (6809) to native mode (6309).
My Archives (68K, Old logic, SSB radio): marc.retronik.fr
[Updated on: Mon, 15 April 2024 04:56] Report message to a moderator
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Re: Caution: fake V9958s on AliExpress [message #10733 is a reply to message #10715] |
Sat, 27 April 2024 12:07   |
lynchaj
Messages: 1080 Registered: June 2016
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Senior Member |
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marcopolo wrote on Mon, 15 April 2024 07:50I agree with Bill.
Andrew, you probably received a blacktopped HD63C09, it could be a 6809, a 68A09, a 68B09 or a 63B09
Please post a high-res photo.
The first test is to scrape the top of the circuit to see if any paint is peeling off (=blacktopped)
I'm not an HITACHI specialist, but you should be able to test this to see if you have a 63B09 or 63C09.
The MOTOROLA 6809 doesn't support additions between registers.
CC0102 LDD #$0102
103089 ADDR A,B
You should find $0003 in register B
Don't forget that for serious tests like speed, you need to switch the CPU from emulation mode (6809) to native mode (6309).
Hi, OK cleared my bench sufficently to get the 6809 processor running and tested. I ran the small test program and it came back with $0003 in B register so I am fairly sure it is a real HD63C09 processor. It doesn't look used or blacktopped. It looks new with none of the suspicious signs of remarking. I am not an expert though.
Possibly it is a remarked HD63C09 but if it is, they did a really good job. I don't see why they would though since the HD63C09s are cheap enough that it would hardly be worth the effort. I got like 5 for $10 or something like that. They seem to be OK.
I can certainly see why they are remarking/faking V9958s though. At $40 a pop, that gets to be real money quickly.
Thanks for the help! Much appreciated, Andrew Lynch
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