|
|
Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects [message #3654 is a reply to message #3649] |
Tue, 24 October 2017 14:19   |
plasmo
Messages: 916 Registered: March 2017 Location: New Mexico, USA
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Ah, good. So there are interests in Tiny68K. I should mention that shipping to US address is $4 for fully assembled board and $3 for partially assembled board. However I'm not quite ready to ship yet. I need to document the procedure for building CompactFlash disk with CP/M-68K and a simpler way to boot up CP/M.
ab0tj wrote on Tue, 24 October 2017 08:58I'd be interested in the $25 option. Even in kit form (with the Altera chip soldered on) to save you some time 
ab0tj,
I'll get tired of building boards eventually, but since this is a new design, I want to build and test more of them to make sure the design is sound.
norwestrzh wrote on Tue, 24 October 2017 10:50I'd be interested too, with reservations about programming and soldering the Altera chip.
Would you sell a "bare board" with programmed Altera attached, and the serial PROM as well?
How difficult is it to find a suitable DRAM SIMM to work with the board?
Roger
Roger,
That'll be the partial assembly for $8. I will also install all the surface mounted components especially the 20pF cap and 27K resistor associated with the 3.6864MHz crystal circuitry. They are 0603 components. Attached are the photos of the partial assembly, component side and solder side. The installed components are pointed with red arrows. I need to install the resistor R13 and header P2 because they are needed to program the Altera EPM7128. The Altera was successfully programmed and verified in this configuration. Not included in the picture is a 24C256 in 8-pin DIP package programmed with the boot software.
Regarding DRAM SIMM, at 8MHz system clock I think any 16meg SIMM72 DRAM will work. Just now I find this item on eBay: https://www.ebay.com/itm/192328564152. It should work, but the price is a bit on the high side. I'll sell a working 16-meg SIMM72 for $4. (FYI, $3 for 68000P10, $2 for 68681, and $1 for oscillator)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects [message #3673 is a reply to message #3672] |
Thu, 26 October 2017 07:41   |
plasmo
Messages: 916 Registered: March 2017 Location: New Mexico, USA
|
Senior Member |
|
|
norwestrzh wrote on Wed, 25 October 2017 23:13OK, Bill,
Put me in for the $8 partial assembly. I have plenty of PDIP 68000's and PDIP 68681's (and oscillators), but I might need to buy one of your 16MB SIMMS.
Have to look in the "junk box" to see if I have any here.
Thanks.
Roger
Roger, I'll put you down for a partial assembly. I'll PM you when I'm ready to ship and you can tell me whether you want the SIMM included (or any parts you may need).
computerdoc wrote on Thu, 26 October 2017 07:45Hi Bill,
I would love to get the Kit #2 with the SMDs soldered and all the other parts included. I am in the middle of saving up for a major repair and refit of my main TOWER PC computer. Will you still be selling these kits in January 2018? I definitely will be getting 1 should they still be available then.
Kip, I have plenty of parts, the only thing that may run out is the pc board. The board can be reordered and is cheap ($4.90 for 10pcs plus shipping--shipping is the expensive part). I put all my design files on the wiki page so anyone can reorder boards and put boards together.
|
|
|
|
|
Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects [message #3678 is a reply to message #3674] |
Thu, 26 October 2017 17:41   |
plasmo
Messages: 916 Registered: March 2017 Location: New Mexico, USA
|
Senior Member |
|
|
rwiker wrote on Thu, 26 October 2017 11:43I'd like Kit #2, if you still have any PCBs left. I'm in Norway, so shipping would obviously be more expensive.
It's intriguing that this little board is significantly more powerful than the Sage II (or IV) from 1983: faster processor, significantly more memory and faster and higher capacity mass storage.
rwiker,
I set aside a Kit #2 for you. I sent a couple packages to Europe recently. The USPS First Class International seems the cheapest shipping option. It is $22.50 for up to 4 pounds.
Never used Sage computer before. Read it up on wikipedia, it seems quite capable and can run a number of different operating systems, including CP/M68K. I wonder any of the other operating system are still available? $3600 for singl-floppy entry-level configuration! Such is the deflationary force of Moore's Law.
etchedpixels wrote on Thu, 26 October 2017 12:46And would be interested in the built one to the UK as well.
etchedpixels,
OK, a fully assembled/tested Tiny68K for you.
Bill
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects [message #3687 is a reply to message #3682] |
Fri, 27 October 2017 18:54   |
zamp
Messages: 19 Registered: April 2017 Location: Finger Lakes, NY, USA
|
Junior Member |
|
|
Bill -- This looks like a fun system. If you still have boards, one Kit#2 with chips programmed and SMT devices soldered for me to NY State, USA. Thanks!
Ron
|
|
|
Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects [message #3689 is a reply to message #3681] |
Fri, 27 October 2017 21:27   |
plasmo
Messages: 916 Registered: March 2017 Location: New Mexico, USA
|
Senior Member |
|
|
computerdoc wrote on Fri, 27 October 2017 05:34Hi Bill,
Please put me on the list for Kit #1 All SMDs are soldered and Programmed. I should have the rest of the parts on hand or can get them when I can. Thanks a bunch.
There is a PLCC version of the EPM7128 that I'm thinking seriously of entering into Eagle so I can see what I can do on the Through hole version of your Tiny68K as an exercise and teaching aid to me. When I figure this board out, I'm let you see a pdf of it. I'd like to see what you think.
Kip,
OK reserve a Kit#2 for you.
Please feel free to redesign/modify all my Tinyxxx boards. I designed all my boards on a 20-year old software called WinDraft & WinBoard by IVEX. IVEX is no longer in business, so the designs need to be recreated on your tools.
As yoda correctly pointed out, the PLCC version of the EPM7128 only has 84 pins instead of the 100-pin EPM7128SQC100. In Tiny68K the 100-pin EPM7128 only has 2 spare pins, so the 84-pin PLCC will not work. I did used a PLCC84 EPM7128 in the Tiny030 design, but it requires external DRAM address mux circuitry. IMO, a 100-pin EPM7128 would've been much better solution and simplify the design considerably.
Bill
|
|
|
Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects [message #3690 is a reply to message #3687] |
Fri, 27 October 2017 22:09   |
plasmo
Messages: 916 Registered: March 2017 Location: New Mexico, USA
|
Senior Member |
|
|
zamp wrote on Fri, 27 October 2017 19:54Bill -- This looks like a fun system. If you still have boards, one Kit#2 with chips programmed and SMT devices soldered for me to NY State, USA. Thanks!
vamp,
OK, reserve a Kit#2 for you. That is the last pc board I have on hand.
--------------
The responses are greater than I expected. Here are the latest status of my works on Tiny68K:
* I encountered a curious bug on "pip" command: when I tried to concatenate multiple files using the command format:
pip file1.txt=file2.txt,file3.txt I get the error message:
Exception $03 at user address $0001B1BA. Aborted.
pip works fine otherwise. This error occurs in simulation as well, so it may be a bug in pip command or corrupted distribution disk.
* Beside the strange bug in "pip", most software work fine except gkermit. It just hung.
* Creating a new CF disk is kludgy. I'm not smart enough to have a general solution that reads CP/M68K image (created with cpmtools) on FAT directory and creates a CP/M CF disk. So my solution right now is using cpmtools to create a CP/M68k image, converting it to srecord and serially loading into the RAMdrive location on Tiny68K. With the disk image loaded and CP/M running, I can then copy the files in the RAMdrive into CF. This works well, except loading 2 megabyte disk image into RAM at 38.4K baud takes about 30 minutes. Only need to do this once to create a new CF disk, but it is slow nevertheless.
* Still working on an utility that will copy first 32K byte of memory into the 2nd serial flash. With this utility a new boot serial flash can be created thus allowing boot software update without the need of an external programmer.
* I did all my tests with SanDisk brand of CF which work well. I do have one Transcend brand of CF that read/write FAT16 files correctly on PC but does not read/write CP/M68k files correctly on Tiny68K. I'm concerned that Tiny68K hardware/software may only work with a subset of CF. I'm ordering a batch of Transcend CF and see if I can figure out what the problems may be.
Bill
|
|
|
|
Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects [message #3693 is a reply to message #3689] |
Sun, 29 October 2017 21:42   |
computerdoc
Messages: 130 Registered: October 2015
|
Senior Member |

|
|
Hi Bill,
Thank you for reserving me a Kit #2. I appreciate it very much. I was very excited to see a PLCC EPM7128, but I shortly figured out that it was not the same pin number nor I/O pin count of the 100 pin device you used in Tiny68K. Oh Shucks. Thanks for all who pointed that out.
I have not been online lately since I was attacked by Fire Ants inside the front door of our house. I found out cars aren't the only things with panic buttons! OUCH! OUCH! OUCH! OUCH! OUCH! I've seen the Doc and I'm doing much better now as long as I'm on my medicine.
Bill, Thanks for giving me the go ahead to reproduce your designs. I appreciate that very much. Feel free to send me all your designs when you have a few moments and I will enter them as soon as I can. The only part giving me trouble so far on Tiny68K is the EPM7128. Your pdf of the schematic has NO PIN NUMBERS anywhere. Would it be possible to put pin numbers on all the parts or at least the CPLD? In an effort to help with this, attached is an unfinished pdf of my Eagle Schematic for Tiny68K that I have created so far. The board lay out is of course a work in progress as well. You will notice a slight change. The PLCC version of the 68000 goes all the way up to 20MHZ, so I took the liberty of replacing the DIP version of the 68000. Of course, this is your design so I will do as you ask. Remember folks, this is an UNFINISHED Tiny68K board being transferred to Eagle so Do NOT USE, yet! Bill, Please let me know if I am anywhere near the right track as it were with this circuit board. When I saw your message, I felt like I needed to respond even though I'm not finished yet. Thanks for everyone's efforts and assistance. Take care my friends.
Kip Koon
computerdoc at sc dot rr dot com
http://www.cocopedia.com/wiki/index.php/User:Computerdoc
|
|
|
|
Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects [message #3695 is a reply to message #3693] |
Sun, 29 October 2017 23:10   |
plasmo
Messages: 916 Registered: March 2017 Location: New Mexico, USA
|
Senior Member |
|
|
computerdoc wrote on Sun, 29 October 2017 22:42Hi Bill,
Thank you for reserving me a Kit #2. I appreciate it very much. I was very excited to see a PLCC EPM7128, but I shortly figured out that it was not the same pin number nor I/O pin count of the 100 pin device you used in Tiny68K. Oh Shucks. Thanks for all who pointed that out.
I have not been online lately since I was attacked by Fire Ants inside the front door of our house. I found out cars aren't the only things with panic buttons! OUCH! OUCH! OUCH! OUCH! OUCH! I've seen the Doc and I'm doing much better now as long as I'm on my medicine.
Bill, Thanks for giving me the go ahead to reproduce your designs. I appreciate that very much. Feel free to send me all your designs when you have a few moments and I will enter them as soon as I can. The only part giving me trouble so far on Tiny68K is the EPM7128. Your pdf of the schematic has NO PIN NUMBERS anywhere. Would it be possible to put pin numbers on all the parts or at least the CPLD? In an effort to help with this, attached is an unfinished pdf of my Eagle Schematic for Tiny68K that I have created so far. The board lay out is of course a work in progress as well. You will notice a slight change. The PLCC version of the 68000 goes all the way up to 20MHZ, so I took the liberty of replacing the DIP version of the 68000. Of course, this is your design so I will do as you ask. Remember folks, this is an UNFINISHED Tiny68K board being transferred to Eagle so Do NOT USE, yet! Bill, Please let me know if I am anywhere near the right track as it were with this circuit board. When I saw your message, I felt like I needed to respond even though I'm not finished yet. Thanks for everyone's efforts and assistance. Take care my friends.
Kip,
I'll take a close look at the schematic and board layout tomorrow. My initial reactions are:
* PLCC 68000 is a good idea, it saves space and there are greater speed options.
* You should also consider a PLCC 68681. I saw one on eBay $12.16 + $1.68 shipping for 10pcs SCN68681 in PLCC44.
* Half size oscillators are great.
* You'll have plenty of room for something else, like a video controller, floppy disk controller, etc. This is a base design for future experiments.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|